International Alternative Energy Center
International Alternative Energy Center
Home | Profile | Register | Active Topics | Active Polls | Members | Private Messages | Search | FAQ
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?




 All Forums
 Forums
 Home Heating
 Wood stove Boiler vs wood gasifier
 New Topic  Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  

olddawgsrule
Advanced Member


USA
1434 Posts

Posted - October 04 2014 :  08:50:50  Show Profile  Visit olddawgsrule's Homepage Send olddawgsrule a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Dave is debating a wood gasifier and Doug asked about cost comparison.
So I thought to start a thread here and let's talk/compare.

Old in age, not in mind, so
'Teach me something new'!

Google AdSense

USA
Mountain View


olddawgsrule
Advanced Member



USA
1434 Posts

Posted - October 04 2014 :  09:20:08  Show Profile  Visit olddawgsrule's Homepage Send olddawgsrule a Private Message  Reply with Quote
My situation is I have a efficient wood burner (80+% rating) and have a FHW system in the home.
So basic costs to convert to a GHW boiler is low.

A comparative sized boiler for my home vs. my wood burner:
Efficiency gain +- 15%
Costs for me +- 40% (over my current stove pricing)
Savings in fuel +- $75 a season (based on what I purchased wood for this year) Base it on current going price.. $105-$120

Re-coup in cost 15 to 20 years

Here's what I consider to be the turning point.
1) Even heat through the home.
2) Controlled burn rate
a) This is where the true efficiency of this unit comes in.
b) The unit adjusts according to demand
These items equate to larger savings in fuel

For a new buyer, I'd probably look at air units vs. water. Up-start costs are lower and can be as simple as a single exchanger (much like having a wood or pellet burner.

Doug you mentioned $800 for your pellets for the season.
I spent (and not typical for me) $475 to heat for this season with wood.
If I could say, with all considerations of efficiency, a gasifier could lower that cost to $285.. For me, in reality, probably more in the range $380.



Old in age, not in mind, so
'Teach me something new'!

Go to Top of Page

olddawgsrule
Advanced Member



USA
1434 Posts

Posted - October 04 2014 :  09:23:18  Show Profile  Visit olddawgsrule's Homepage Send olddawgsrule a Private Message  Reply with Quote
If anyone knows of someone currently using one, please have them chime in!

I'd love to hear some real numbers.
I'm reading up on this over at my other favorite site:
You must be logged in to see this link.
There are folks there that are using them!


Old in age, not in mind, so
'Teach me something new'!

Go to Top of Page

IrishDave
Senior Member



Ireland
850 Posts

Posted - October 04 2014 :  10:55:39  Show Profile Send IrishDave a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The Slovakian lady I spoke to uses one in her home. She gave me her number to make an appointment to drop down and see one in action. She shows how to clean them out, followed by lighting it up and seeing and feeling the heat in a real environment, unlike a showroom.
She says they can burn up to 12 hours on one load, but that 8-10 hours is more realistic on a slightly higher setting.
Savings for me should include hot water on tap and cheaper fuel bills such as gas and electric.
My washing machine and dishwasher both heat the water with electric, but with a gasifier I would have the option to allow hot water from my tank to be used - saving 90% power on each wash.
I can't remember if I already mentioned that I am getting the outside walls of my home pumped with insulation. The house next store to me got it done last year and he is saving about 10 euros each week on heating bills.
I have been advised to take this step first before investing in a new heating system.
I only got a new condenser gas boiler last year too.
Go to Top of Page

olddawgsrule
Advanced Member



USA
1434 Posts

Posted - October 04 2014 :  11:31:21  Show Profile  Visit olddawgsrule's Homepage Send olddawgsrule a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Very good!
Nothing like first hand operation vs. a showroom.

First I'd like you to look at the system of air in and air out.
Almost all the 'high end' units I've been looking at seem to be either power intake or power exhaust. Believe this has a lot to do with it's ability to control under demand.

Second is just that.. Does it truly control under demand.

Third is: Is she running straight from the unit or using a storage medium?
This is the other thing I'm reading quite a bit about. They seem to work best with a storage medium, increasing their efficiency.

Please do check out the site I've mentioned. People there are from all over and may just find someone already using this unit. Even if not, great info there and people using like units both inside and out.


Old in age, not in mind, so
'Teach me something new'!

Go to Top of Page

olddawgsrule
Advanced Member



USA
1434 Posts

Posted - October 04 2014 :  12:05:15  Show Profile  Visit olddawgsrule's Homepage Send olddawgsrule a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Forgot another..

Does it have the option of the 'Hopper' add-on?
I'm seeing most do.
Not knowing your area cost per cord or species burned (BTU value) or if pellets are an option for you (and cost per ton).
It could be another option for you.
Always nice to have options..


Old in age, not in mind, so
'Teach me something new'!

Go to Top of Page

cas467062
Junior Member



USA
75 Posts

Posted - March 11 2015 :  22:22:21  Show Profile Send cas467062 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey Olddawgsrule...have you checked out "mass rocket heaters"? You can be very creative with these type of heaters!!

Corey
Go to Top of Page

olddawgsrule
Advanced Member



USA
1434 Posts

Posted - March 14 2015 :  08:00:37  Show Profile  Visit olddawgsrule's Homepage Send olddawgsrule a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Do you have one Corey?
Curious of real life usage.

Old in age, not in mind, so
'Teach me something new'!

Go to Top of Page

cas467062
Junior Member



USA
75 Posts

Posted - March 25 2015 :  00:10:41  Show Profile Send cas467062 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey ODR

Sry I forgot to check back here...I just subscribed also

No actually I have not built one as of yet but I do look forward to building one later this year...I have researched them and have talked with 2 ppl who have them over the last few yrs and they love em!! I plan on building one for a shop as I should be able to load it once a day and maintain a good radiant heat...the ppl I've spoken with use them in their homes and will not go back to conventional wood stoves..now both of them have roughly 1000 sq ft homes so..not trying to heat a huge space by any means but use 25% or less wood than the stoves they had so...definitely worth trying it out in a shop space then who knows!!

Corey
Go to Top of Page

olddawgsrule
Advanced Member



USA
1434 Posts

Posted - March 28 2015 :  08:36:19  Show Profile  Visit olddawgsrule's Homepage Send olddawgsrule a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I've researched a few and built 2 small rocket stoves to understand the principle (well, small is in the eye of the beholder.. LOL)..

The mass of these (size) I find a deterrent (for my situation), yet even with that said, I'm seeing some good 'reported' results.

I have not attempted a vertical loading style and can see how that could be a long burn. I do see issues with smoke or back-draft on a cold start.. Horizontal vent pipe, length to warm... Ya, a couple of concerns there.. (I do have a thought on a possible solution).

If you haven't already, please start a thread on this.
Several of us are interested and if you proceed into building, it would be great to follow your progress and hopefully help out along the way.



Old in age, not in mind, so
'Teach me something new'!

Go to Top of Page

cas467062
Junior Member



USA
75 Posts

Posted - March 28 2015 :  15:15:06  Show Profile Send cas467062 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey ODR

To start, I think the mass rocket heater may not be aesthetically pleasing to some or most as the exposure of the barrel whether it's covered in cob or not may not fit the modern design but also being able to be creative as possible...

With the smoke or backdraft i think a simple computer fan or something towards the end of the exhaust turned on at the start would completely eliminate this until the fire starts burning...the ppl I kno who have these made the comment that the only time this happened was when someone opened an exterior door at the same time they were lighting a fire...tho this may be different individually...

I do plan on starting a thread on this when I get to this point...of course everyone's input is very welcome!!! And I do plan on taking many step-by-step pics as well as I go along...

There's also a website that goes into great depth with these heaters if you haven't seen already..it's permies.com..

Corey
Go to Top of Page

cas467062
Junior Member



USA
75 Posts

Posted - March 29 2015 :  12:35:22  Show Profile Send cas467062 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey ODR

Here's a link to a mass rocket heater being used to heat floor space..thought you'd be interested in checking it out...

Those creative ideas!!

You must be logged in to see this link.

Corey
Go to Top of Page

cas467062
Junior Member



USA
75 Posts

Posted - March 29 2015 :  14:49:37  Show Profile Send cas467062 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey ODR

Oh sry about that!! Should I repost that to new thread? See...I'm not paying attention!! lol

Corey
Go to Top of Page

olddawgsrule
Advanced Member



USA
1434 Posts

Posted - March 29 2015 :  14:50:13  Show Profile  Visit olddawgsrule's Homepage Send olddawgsrule a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Just opened it and please do

Old in age, not in mind, so
'Teach me something new'!

Go to Top of Page

kcarring
Moderator



Canada
1057 Posts

Posted - April 01 2015 :  01:16:31  Show Profile Send kcarring a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ihave a wood gasifier but ive been so damn busy with my company i havent had the time to play with it yet.

this is a video of the same unit i got, done by the guy who made it



~~~~~~~~~~~~~
You wouldn't laugh at my igloo if you knew how cold my beer is!

Edited by - kcarring on April 01 2015 01:17:09
Go to Top of Page

olddawgsrule
Advanced Member



USA
1434 Posts

Posted - April 03 2015 :  16:02:49  Show Profile  Visit olddawgsrule's Homepage Send olddawgsrule a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Very cool!
Post up a video of yours running!!!

Old in age, not in mind, so
'Teach me something new'!

Go to Top of Page

olddawgsrule
Advanced Member



USA
1434 Posts

Posted - April 03 2015 :  16:23:08  Show Profile  Visit olddawgsrule's Homepage Send olddawgsrule a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Okay... It's killin' me..
Which model did you get?
Going to run it on? Pellets? Chips?
How big and how long will a 'hopper' full go?

Go play with the thing will ya!! LOL!

Very cool Kyle!

Old in age, not in mind, so
'Teach me something new'!

Go to Top of Page

kcarring
Moderator



Canada
1057 Posts

Posted - April 29 2015 :  21:51:36  Show Profile Send kcarring a Private Message  Reply with Quote
i bought the alpha proto type of the E1... the big brother to the initial small M1.. but he keeps changing the names, he's only been in business about 2 years....

im just so damn busy i dont have time to get into it :(

in theory i should be able to run a 20-45 hp engine, for 2-3 hrs on a 20lb sack of chips, outputting aPPROXIMATELY 3-4000 WATTS

THE CONFUSING PART ABOUT WOOD GASIFIERS, IS,

you are creating a less energetic fuel, so, for example, if you are running a 20 hp engine, your not going to get 14,000 watts.

so higher efficiency low rpm motors seems to do better than inefficient high rpm motors

you can also do heat reclamation from its losses.. but you wouldnt have a wood gasifier "in your house". it has no chimney.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~
You wouldn't laugh at my igloo if you knew how cold my beer is!

Edited by - kcarring on April 29 2015 21:54:51
Go to Top of Page
  Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
 New Topic  Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Jump To:
International Alternative Energy Center © 2000-2009 ForumCo.com Go To Top Of Page
This page was generated in 0.27 seconds. Snitz Forums 2000
RSS Feed 1 RSS Feed 2
Powered by ForumCo 2000-2008
TOS - AUP - URA - Privacy Policy
ForumCo Free Blogs and Galleries
Signup for a free forum or Go Banner Free