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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 11 2012 :  07:22:13  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ok -update on the system.
I have finished the steam reaction chamber and the GEET style inlet-modifyed ofcourse lol.
Electronic parts should arrive on tuesday for the pulse generator to pulse the altinator.
The new ignition setup on the motor is up and running and doing better than expected-turns out i can adjust the timeing by 4 deg just by the pot.
We are getting close to the first run-i would say about a week away if all go's well


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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n/a
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2079 Posts

Posted - March 11 2012 :  13:57:06  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message  Reply with Quote
what source did you use to find the 60 ltr drum? i have been looking all over the web to find something similar and nothing lol.

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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 11 2012 :  16:55:45  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi SD3T
It was actualy my brewing drum lol--no more home made burbon now lol.


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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n/a
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2079 Posts

Posted - March 11 2012 :  19:00:07  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message  Reply with Quote
oh no,,, where did you find a drum like that one any way? looks like a perfect size. i would not mind finding one of those.

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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 11 2012 :  21:35:06  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Just go to your local brewing shop, they would have them


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 15 2012 :  09:42:08  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
HHO and a lot of other stuff lol



swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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n/a
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2079 Posts

Posted - March 15 2012 :  21:44:01  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message  Reply with Quote
nice score on all the goodies. can not wait to see that motor running!

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Kudzu
Administrator



USA
1619 Posts

Posted - March 16 2012 :  01:27:34  Show Profile Send Kudzu a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey TM,
I wish I could shop where you shop ... You get some fun toy's there !!!

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I still think the only dumb questions are the one's you didn't ask ...
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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 16 2012 :  03:05:57  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
lol-i need a bigger shed


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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msmjr
Average Member



USA
444 Posts

Posted - March 16 2012 :  14:32:57  Show Profile Send msmjr a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Not a shed like I said a FREAKEN BARN!! LOL

Growing old is mandatory, Growing up......optional.
He is wise who gains wisdom from another's mishaps.
—Plutius Syrus
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kcarring
Moderator



Canada
1057 Posts

Posted - March 16 2012 :  16:05:23  Show Profile Send kcarring a Private Message  Reply with Quote
@tinman

Have a look, anything is fair game if you need it. Just pay shipping, and I may be able to get commercial rate on that, soon. I get this stuff all the time.



As far as I know the little guy is an oxygen concentrator, the silver cylinder says "sieve bed". The taller unit is a hyper pure reverse osmosis unit, so the big nylon chamber, not sure, perhaps the membrane itself.. I'm not sure why it'd be nylon. So maybe we got an air compressor in the one, and a water pump in the other... I'll find out more.

Mainly I thought you might be interested in the pure oxygen rated fittings, possibly the recombination block on the RO unit.. stuff like that.

@Tinman

Here is a better look. Not as unique of stuff as I had hoped, but nonetheless, here it is: (still uploading)


~~~~~~~~~~~~~
You wouldn't laugh at my igloo if you knew how cold my beer is!

Edited by - kcarring on March 16 2012 22:54:20
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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 17 2012 :  08:16:25  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
well i did coment yesterday kcarring-but now it's gone???
did you get my email?


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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kcarring
Moderator



Canada
1057 Posts

Posted - March 17 2012 :  13:05:32  Show Profile Send kcarring a Private Message  Reply with Quote
@tinman yes I tried to respond in the email there. I think most of all you'd be interested in the distrobution block, related metering devices. Although they are for water... but still. As for the air compressor / vacuum pump and water pump, honestly, I don't think you should bother because by the time we get the shipping paid for you likely could find something locally cheaper. I saw a similar used pump on ebay for only $40. If I made a package of the distro-block and all the stainless fittings and sent that to you, I can hang on to the rest for now, and we'll see how things work out. I get this stuff a lot. I've given away many motors engines etc, dozens. I had hoped to find you an oxygen compressor, which I may, one day, still. This unit is "on demand" so it doesn't need one. They are bit more rare though. They are built with 316L stainless in and out.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~
You wouldn't laugh at my igloo if you knew how cold my beer is!

Edited by - kcarring on March 17 2012 13:08:42
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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 17 2012 :  22:31:53  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi Kcarring
Just grab a shipping price first and we'll go from there.As far as an oxygen compressor go's -well there easy,a good old fridge motor compressor will work just fine once cleaned out.
Cheers


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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Kudzu
Administrator



USA
1619 Posts

Posted - March 17 2012 :  22:55:48  Show Profile Send Kudzu a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey TM ,
The same type fridge compressor's make pretty dang good vacuum pumps , also.


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I still think the only dumb questions are the one's you didn't ask ...
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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 18 2012 :  17:26:42  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi kudzu-yes that they do


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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n/a
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2079 Posts

Posted - March 18 2012 :  21:06:05  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message  Reply with Quote
never use a vacuum pump to take out the air on cheetos bag!!! the chips got smashed

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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 19 2012 :  06:00:45  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
SD3T-lol-are you sure it was the chips that were smashed lol.
Ok i have a question for those in the know--with a dry cell it seems they get bad current leakage around the outside edge and at the hole's through the plates.
So i have an idea i would like your thoughts.
It seems that at those leakage points most of the HHO is produced and most of the current is used.
So my plan was to eliminate this problem by causeing much more of the problem lol.
So my plan is-and my question to you is-what if perferated plates were used insted of solid plates?
By perferated plate i mean the s/s plate that has all those little hole's through it.
At work we use a lot of this for sound proofing cells and walls.
Would not that leakage then be shared between all the hole's and produce a lot more HHO?
This would also garentee an even flow of water through the cell aswell.
Your thought's???


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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msmjr
Average Member



USA
444 Posts

Posted - March 19 2012 :  20:48:55  Show Profile Send msmjr a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey Tinman
Ive been looking at these and wondered the same thing. Why would you limit water flow through the plates? I have a cooler carrier that mounts in a trailer hitch 5/16" holes corrugated 3/16" thick SS but the surface area loss would be to great. Always a trade off. If it were me it would have 3 ovals on top and 2 at the bottom. If youve seen this guy You must be logged in to see this link. large plates same small holes. He gets huge production but hes also using rectified 110/240v (not practical) altough a forced hot water furnace heating system with...um...piping in the floor....hmmm.

Growing old is mandatory, Growing up......optional.
He is wise who gains wisdom from another's mishaps.
—Plutius Syrus

Edited by - msmjr on March 19 2012 20:51:06
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Kudzu
Administrator



USA
1619 Posts

Posted - March 19 2012 :  21:31:23  Show Profile Send Kudzu a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey TM.
Most of the hydrogen brick's I've seen are set up on the premiss that HHO will try to travel up and out , in turn the electrolyte will be drawn in to replace the escaping HHO .. I've seen a few variant's but, nobody seriously trying to change the design .

Maybe inside the neutral plate's a type of Stainless screen ?

I was looking over Stan Mayer design and it look's like he used coil's to hit the frequency of Hydrogen / to make his system produce enough .
Not to mention Hydrogen is 2 1/2 time's more powerful than gas in an explosion , So a lot less LPM should actually be needed , According to Stan Mayer .

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I still think the only dumb questions are the one's you didn't ask ...
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msmjr
Average Member



USA
444 Posts

Posted - March 20 2012 :  06:25:28  Show Profile Send msmjr a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey Guys
Ok another thought and Ill have you know this woke me and got me out of bed. LOL The holes all have 90deg angles and lined up. I know its not a spark gap and not sure how to describe what im thinking. A: round all edges B: stagger the holes on top do 3-2-3 then on the bottom 1-2-1. It may eliminate the focus point and spread it out. I know Im going the opposite direction but just a WAG!

Growing old is mandatory, Growing up......optional.
He is wise who gains wisdom from another's mishaps.
—Plutius Syrus
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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 20 2012 :  09:51:47  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi Guys-some good points there.
I was thinking of this stuff though(see pic below).I have found only one guy on the web that has used it and he said after much testing he go 32% more HHO for watts used by useing the perforated mesh-and also less heat aswell.If more gas is produced around the holes in a normal dry cell-why not use sheets that are full of hole's lol.
Anyway---have i got a big supprise for you lot lol,and i mean WORLD CHANGEING on an enviromental level and fuel saveings.
I gave my HHO motor a run for two hour's tonight without the HHO lol.80% water and 20% accetone.Now 2 hours on 1 cup of fuel is preaty good-but thats not the best part.All im going to say is that im that hipe'd up i wont be getting much sleep tonight lol.
I will make a vidio tomorow after work and post it as soon as i can-you are going to see the Impossible happen right befor your eyes lol.
I gota go have a smoke lol.


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 20 2012 :  09:53:35  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Lol-so excited i forgot the pic of the sheeting lol



swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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49er
Administrator



USA
4442 Posts

Posted - March 20 2012 :  10:32:43  Show Profile Send 49er a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi TM

What is the size dimensions of the of the SS and what is it called.

Doug
The sky is not the limit...There are footprints on the MOON.
Your only as DUMB as where your standing.
No matter where you go there you are.
You must be logged in to see this link.
SKYPE bxx49er
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msmjr
Average Member



USA
444 Posts

Posted - March 20 2012 :  10:53:42  Show Profile Send msmjr a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey TinMan
Thats exactly what I was talking about.





Growing old is mandatory, Growing up......optional.
He is wise who gains wisdom from another's mishaps.
—Plutius Syrus
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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 20 2012 :  17:26:42  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi 49er
It's any size you like and avalible with any size hole's.It is called s/s perforated sheeting as msm has pictured above.


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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49er
Administrator



USA
4442 Posts

Posted - March 20 2012 :  19:23:29  Show Profile Send 49er a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi All

That looks good for the wet style, I will try to find it for the next build.

Doug
The sky is not the limit...There are footprints on the MOON.
Your only as DUMB as where your standing.
No matter where you go there you are.
You must be logged in to see this link.
SKYPE bxx49er
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n/a
deleted



2079 Posts

Posted - March 20 2012 :  20:12:28  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message  Reply with Quote
awww come on doug, it will not take you that long to drill those holes lol.

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n/a
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2079 Posts

Posted - March 20 2012 :  20:13:59  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message  Reply with Quote
hey tinman, you used 80% water and 20% accetone, was that just to condition the plates? and remove any forien particals?

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Kudzu
Administrator



USA
1619 Posts

Posted - March 20 2012 :  20:50:27  Show Profile Send Kudzu a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'm thinking if I find some SS plate to use .. If they were stacked up, clamped together and the top plate laid out in the pattern , my drill press would make short work of making those holes .. This would have one advantage as the gasket area could easily be saved that way for a brick design .
If I can't find any reasonable around here .

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I still think the only dumb questions are the one's you didn't ask ...
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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 21 2012 :  03:44:20  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi SD3T
The HHO system wasnt used at all,it was just sucking the water and accetone through the heat exchanger and the other little magic box lol.But the big supprise is yet to come.


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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iaec
Forum Admin



1033 Posts

Posted - March 21 2012 :  05:18:06  Show Profile Send iaec a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi TM,

Nine pages already...got some chatching up to do...^^
Good going on your HHO project.

TimberJack

Vladimir Zamir Thodé

***Possibilities Within The Impossible***
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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 21 2012 :  07:19:11  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks TJ
As you will see there are a few of us doing the HHO thing at the moment-haveing a break from the pulse motor saga for a while,and to be honust i am quite enjoying this little experiment lol.
Hey Kudzu-i hope you have a good drill bit as s/s is a rite cw to drill.


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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shakamuni01
Average Member



USA
213 Posts

Posted - March 21 2012 :  08:10:47  Show Profile Send shakamuni01 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi Tinman

what do you mean by pulsing your alternator. I thought the alternator was an output mechanism.... or did you mean pulsing the output of the alternator via a transistor or something to create the BEMF?
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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 21 2012 :  09:28:48  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi shakamuni01.
An alternator needs an input current to the rotor to magnetise it to get an output.It is the rotor i pulse with current-this give's an output pulse square to the input pulse at 10 times the input pulse.So if i send 2 volts at 2 amps to the rotor then i will get 20 volts at 20 amps out of the alternator.If i pulse this current going into the rotor with a square wave then i get a pulsed DC output after the diodes


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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pcmagnut
Average Member



USA
265 Posts

Posted - March 21 2012 :  11:37:49  Show Profile Send pcmagnut a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi all
TM A rite cw to drill LMAO.
I am going to have to read this whole thread. I gave up on HHO a while back when I was
having to repair and maintain my 6 cell water4gas style system every other day. Looks like things have come a long way since then, going to have to rethink this.
Thanks
PC
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Kudzu
Administrator



USA
1619 Posts

Posted - March 21 2012 :  15:52:53  Show Profile Send Kudzu a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey TM ,
TJ's gonna have to edit the cuss word filter .. cw is worse than a four letter word around here , rotflmao

=============================================================================

I still think the only dumb questions are the one's you didn't ask ...
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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 21 2012 :  16:44:52  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
lol sorry couldnt help myself
Anyway have a look at this and see what you think.



swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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msmjr
Average Member



USA
444 Posts

Posted - March 21 2012 :  20:23:45  Show Profile Send msmjr a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey TinMan
Thats quite cool, still amazes me how many ways you can come up with to skin a cat. LOL
And you answered my question at the end I belive to replace the Acetone with the HHO system?
I need to go back and look at that exhaust manifold set up again. Does the smallish tube in the exhaust just pass through or does it act as a balance tube?

Growing old is mandatory, Growing up......optional.
He is wise who gains wisdom from another's mishaps.
—Plutius Syrus
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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 21 2012 :  21:41:18  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi msm
The small steam tube spirals around the inner inlet tube. This makes the exaust gases spin around the inlet tube creating a lot more heat in the heat exchanger


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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msmjr
Average Member



USA
444 Posts

Posted - March 21 2012 :  22:36:12  Show Profile Send msmjr a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey TinMan
That makes sense more heat more steam keeps droplets from forming. You could also insulate it with header tape. Correct me if Im wrong, the HHO exhaust should be a lot cooler so by heating everything up helps the atomization of the fuel.

Growing old is mandatory, Growing up......optional.
He is wise who gains wisdom from another's mishaps.
—Plutius Syrus
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Kudzu
Administrator



USA
1619 Posts

Posted - March 21 2012 :  22:52:09  Show Profile Send Kudzu a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey TM,
I like it ... The motor your using look's to be a Honda clone .
The radiator / is it just a modified automobile radiator ?
If so I wonder if a heater core would cool it enuff .

=============================================================================

I still think the only dumb questions are the one's you didn't ask ...
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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 21 2012 :  23:29:01  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi guys
In a normal situation you let cold air go into the motor and much hotter air is expeld from the exaust
This means that due to expansion we end up with a lot more than we put in
My idea was to heat the gases befor they enter the engin then cool them to a lower temp when they leave so as we have less than we put in
As you can see it dose indeed work
But something else happens aswell
The reason it will run for more than an hour on 1 cup of fuel is because any unburnt fuel is recycled back to the bubbled and sent back into the motor
This project has so much more to come yet


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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Kudzu
Administrator



USA
1619 Posts

Posted - March 22 2012 :  00:07:52  Show Profile Send Kudzu a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey Tinman ,
Have ya tried any sort of load off the motor ? I'm just curious if it still has HP or if it's all it can do is just to sustain rotation at this point .
I know when the HHO come's to play, should let loose more power and oxygen then , so I guess it would be a moot thought then , lol

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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 22 2012 :  01:08:49  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi kudzu
Will be bolting the alternator back on tonight for load testing


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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Kudzu
Administrator



USA
1619 Posts

Posted - March 22 2012 :  04:56:20  Show Profile Send Kudzu a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey TM,
I just had another thought .. In the US we usta have what they call hit and miss engine's .. They would use a large flywheel to carry the momentum on while it would miss the next firing but, maintain a steady workload ... If the motor you have didn't have enough oomph , maybe it would help .. Also, it should help stabilize it through the cough's and sputter's .

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I still think the only dumb questions are the one's you didn't ask ...
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49er
Administrator



USA
4442 Posts

Posted - March 22 2012 :  13:49:22  Show Profile Send 49er a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi TM

That is a great run. Have you checked for galling or valve warping or how hot the cylinder is getting before you put a load on it.

Doug
The sky is not the limit...There are footprints on the MOON.
Your only as DUMB as where your standing.
No matter where you go there you are.
You must be logged in to see this link.
SKYPE bxx49er
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TinMan
Advanced Member



4082 Posts

Posted - March 22 2012 :  17:25:41  Show Profile Send TinMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi Kudzu
Funny you mentioned the hit and miss motors as that is exactly what im looking for-but do you think i can find one any were.
49er-After the run i decided to check the sparkplug to make sure the motor wasnt running lean,and guess what-i could hold the spark plug in my hands and not get burnt.It was warm but not hot like it normaly would be-im still trying to work out why???. Im guessing it's because im useing water and accetone wich is pure alcohol.


swim at 90 degrees to the current and gain speed in two directions

skype-thetinman.69
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49er
Administrator



USA
4442 Posts

Posted - March 22 2012 :  20:01:43  Show Profile Send 49er a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi TM

You might find info about a hit and miss at either Henry Ford museum of Edison's Green field village, there were big in the oil fields here in Michigan. We used to ride cycles there 25 yrs ago and could show you 50 of them. LOL ALL GONE

Doug
The sky is not the limit...There are footprints on the MOON.
Your only as DUMB as where your standing.
No matter where you go there you are.
You must be logged in to see this link.
SKYPE bxx49er
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shakamuni01
Average Member



USA
213 Posts

Posted - March 24 2012 :  19:46:28  Show Profile Send shakamuni01 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi TM

I was still trying to understand why you cooled the exhaust before reinjecting it if you were going through the process of recorperating the heat back into the engine. Also someone mentioned the HHO would burn cooler, but most who have tinkered with it in their car engines say it burns a lot hotter.

Another idle thought to throw out there. What happens for the HHO elements if you use different types of metal. I know different types of metal in a electrolyte solution will create some sort of voltage anyway, so would that make the amp consumption lower. Something like galvy and magnesium or copper.

I look forward to the development.
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